Date: 2/5/2003
Time: 2:34:13 PM
Q. comes to mind, what keeps us from walking hand in hand with the healer? Nancy-Wi
Date: 2/6/2003
Time: 12:49:29 PM
Forgiving sins - healing of paralysis... food for thought. What keeps us paralyzed? Our refusal to continue to grow, perhaps? I had to wear a cast once, and I remember how weak my atrophied leg was when it came out - and how sore the muscles got when I started exercising them again. Hmmm... when/where are we paralyzed when we don't have to be? I wonder about the connection with the "just say yes" message of the epistle. The circumstances around this man's paralysis are not revealed, but I'd venture to say we paralyze ourselves in many ways. It takes someone to forgive sins and release us from whatever bondage we have for us to pick up our mat and walk.
early, early pondering.
Date: 2/6/2003
Time: 12:50:02 PM
oops - sorry; that was from me, Sally in GA
Date: 2/11/2003
Time: 6:31:07 AM
This is the first sign of conflict in Mark's gospel. Up until now the responses to Jesus have been astonishment and awe. This is the first time that Jesus has done anything so bold as to tell a person that their sins are forgiven. Although he has been "proclaiming the message about the kingdom of God," and healing and casting out demons, those things have not been as controversial as his statement to the paralytic that his sins are forgiven.
It is the scribes who have a problem with Jesus forgiving sins. What the scribes say is true, but they have not made a connection between Jesus and God. They do not perceive his relationship with God.
Jesus doesn't back down from the controversy. In fact, he establishes a link between physical healing and the content of his proclamation in v. 10, "But so that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins..."
Creature Wayne in GA
Date: 2/11/2003
Time: 7:27:41 AM
The scribes are the ones who question Jesus and his authority to say the things he says. They were the religious establishment of the day. It seems that the scribes would rather have seen the paralytic remain as he was than to have to make adjustments to their understanding and experience of God. That is, they had God wrapped up in a nice, tidy package that they carried around with them and pulled out when it was convenient. Now they were going to have to totally rethink their understanding of God.
The church is the religious establishment of the modern day. We are like the scribes in that we have our own neat, tidy understanding of God and we are continually having to adjust to the new things that God is doing in our midst. This is not easy to do. I know that I resist change and many of my parishioners resist change even more strongly that I do. I am impatient with and judgmental of those who resist more strongly than I do, but on the other hand, I am in conflict with God when I want to cling to my old experiences and understandings. I guess God is impatient with me at those times. As I see it, this text really hits us where we live.
Creature Wayne in GA
Date: 2/11/2003
Time: 1:47:35 PM
As I read this text, I am struck by the fact that Christ cares more about the people than for the property (the roof) or the propriety (the human customs/ideas about forgiveness)of the scribes.
How many times are we guilty of letting property concerns or our own customs or ways of doing things be placed ahead of the Gospel? Or ahead of those who need to hear and claim God's grace?
JJ in Charleston, SC
Date: 2/15/2003
Time: 6:38:08 PM
Jim Hammond who reads this forum -- I answered your e-mail ... but my reply bounced. Thanks for your note.
Sorry, gang, for the personal note.
Blessings, Eric in KS
Date: 2/16/2003
Time: 10:53:20 AM
Is not this the church, these four who bring the sick man to Jesus, not matter the obstacle?
Last week (thanks to Eric's note about Anger verses Pity) I spoke of the need for the church to get angry to care for those who have been isolated. Here the anger is put into motion, the paralytic is raised and lowered into the presence of Christ because of the action of those around him. This is what we are all called to do.
Seems to me that when there is even disagreement or hostility within the church, it is important for others to work for reconcilation, to help brake down the walls that divide, and not to allow the church to be a place where projections become powerful and where resentment fills the space. The four are our models, our examples of what it means to bring others to Christ.
tom in ga
Date: 2/16/2003
Time: 2:42:04 PM
A question to explore - thinking of the four men - Who cared enough to carry us into the church? Who do we care about enough to carry them into church? What keeps us from walking with the healer? Sin. PH in OH
Date: 2/16/2003
Time: 5:10:00 PM
Jesus passed to the church his authority to forgive sins. We have the power to forgive in Jesus' name (which we UM's do [not sure about other denoms. liturgy, but I suspect they do, too] whenever we celebrate the eucharist). Who tries to stop us from forgiving? I think the world definitely gets nervous when the church starts talking about forgiving murderers & violent criminals & dictators & ESPECIALLY our enemies. But I think most often, it's the church that tells itself not to forgive. It's a hard thing to do, and WE'D rather not forgive our enemies. But we must. We have been given the power (Mt. 16:19) AND the commandment (Mt. 5:44). Early rantings. Ken in WV (WHAT?! HE posted early?)
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 5:34:39 AM
"I say to you, stand up, take your mat and go to your home."
This is almost too providential! For the past several years, since we remodeled the chancel area of St. Francis church, there has been a 9x11 Kirman rug under the altar. It belongs to my wife and I, something we purchased back in our "wealthy" days for the dining room of a home we had in another city. There was no room in our current home where it could be used, so it spent a couple of years in storage. After the remodeling, it worked beautifully in the church, so we "loaned" it to the parish -- good for the church, good for us, good for the rug - a win-win situation.
This Sunday being my last as rector/pastor of the parish, we are taking up our rug and going home.... (Actually, we have use of a truck to move my office furniture -- also mine -- and the carpet on Thursday, so it will already be gone on Sunday morning. A rather visual image of the end of our relationship.)
I probably won't say a thing about it, but this verse keeps attracting my attention.
Blessings, Eric in KS
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 5:35:32 AM
Oops .. the grammar police will get me ... "It [the rug] belongs to my wife and ME....."
Eric
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 5:38:50 AM
The image of the four men carrying the paralytic into the house reminds me of an ad from the Church Ad Project. The caption is "Will it take six strong men to bring you back into the church?" and the picture is of six pallbearers carrying a coffin up the church steps. One wonders how many spiritually paralyzed people we could carry into the church, but who won't be carried in until after their last day.
Monday musings...
Eric in KS
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 6:42:21 AM
"When he saw their faith, he said to the paralytic..." Mark seems to say that the faith of the friends got Jesus attention rather than the faith (or the plight) of the paralytic. Thank God for the Church, even in its weakness. Thank God for those who have prayed for us and believed for us when we have not been able to pray or to believe.How do we speak of such experiences so that the faith of others cam be built up.
Craig in MN
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 7:11:03 AM
hehe, I just picture Simon's mother-in-law, (I think that is who they are staying with) looking up at her ceiling and saying "SIMON!!! you better get that carpenter friend of yours to fix that before you even THINK of leaving!!!" vicar Matt
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 8:09:21 AM
A couple of thoughts, I like many of you get calls from senior citzens who can go grocery shopping and get their hair done, but some how the effort to get to church is not there. But they want assurance that we will bury them! They are paralysed in some way, maybe many ways. I would appreciate some insights others may have on this.
Second, in CPE another pastor wrote sermon on this passage from the stand point of the person being carried. how hard it was to accept the help needed to get to Jesus, how hard it is for us to accept the help we are called to give.
Third, this is the week we are using "Put your hand in the hand of the man who stills the water." this is an Elvis hit. Lyrics.com and sheetmusic.com are helpful sights.
Fourth: Last year we used In the Shadow of the Palms" for palm sunday as a theme running through the entire service. anybody know of a similiar song that might work for this year?
Eric, our prayers will be with you this week. Just put your hand in the hand of the man who stilled the water! Nancy-Wi
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 10:23:12 AM
One of the joys of preaching the lectionary has occurred... insight into the bigger picture! In light of these last weeks of healings, casting out demons, cleansing the leper, etc... each time the crowd gets bigger and brings him more sick people. Several times Jesus has tried to re-direct the crowd... and his disciples, to take control of the direction of his ministry... "Yes, I can heal bodies ... but I want to do so much more for you!" We're seen that and heard that in several ways and several encounters up 'til now. Today, it is very specific -- Jesus is throwing down a gauntlet almost it seems. Ok folks... for today's lesson... I want you to HEAR & to SEE -- what is easier to heal his body or to forgive sins...??? Don't just ask for what's easiest... plead for what's deepest and requires not just a healer, but a Savior, a Messiah! Thanks my cyber-church family! Shalom, RevAmy
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 10:23:46 AM
Off topic ... but can anyone help with this ? I am collecting in last year's palm crosses to burn for Ash Wednesday ... does anyone have access to a simple liturgy that could accompnay the burning of the crosses ?
Rev Ev in Bev UK
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 10:27:00 AM
Just a brief off-topic note -- Thank you Eric for all of the many ways you have impacted my preaching, even when I haven't posted. And to the rest of my friends and family here at DPS, I've been around, listening and praying... thank you for continuing to feed me! (I know there is a prayer board somewhere, but if you will forgive me, please add my husband & me to your prayer lists -- he was deployed with the TN National Guard in January! Thanks!) RevAmy
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 11:58:49 AM
Here is a new Palm Sunday piece of music people might try, "Ain't No Rock Gonna' Shout for Me" ny J. Paul Williams and Lloyd Larson, published by Lorenz, #10/2961L. PH in OH
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 1:16:11 PM
"2:4 And when they could not bring him to Jesus because of the crowd, they removed the roof above him; and after having dug through it, they let down the mat on which the paralytic lay." This raises questions for me about what keeps us from experiencing the healing and forgiveness of Jesus. What keeps us from going to the lengths of tearing out the roof, or anything else that keeps us from relationship with Christ? Just pondering. Eric in KS, my prayers are with you as you conclude this phase of your ministry and your life this Sunday. May you know that Christ's peace and love surround you as you go. Peace to all of you Mike in SK
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 1:16:56 PM
"2:4 And when they could not bring him to Jesus because of the crowd, they removed the roof above him; and after having dug through it, they let down the mat on which the paralytic lay." This raises questions for me about what keeps us from experiencing the healing and forgiveness of Jesus. What keeps us from going to the lengths of tearing out the roof, or anything else that keeps us from relationship with Christ? Just pondering. Eric in KS, my prayers are with you as you conclude this phase of your ministry and your life this Sunday. May you know that Christ's peace and love surround you as you go. Peace to all of you Mike in SK
Date: 2/17/2003
Time: 10:14:36 PM
I want to add my words of gratitude to Eric in Ks for all the clarifying and resourcing ways you contribute to this desperate community. I went to your consulting site and having seen it, am even more persuaded that you will continue to be of great service in whatever is your next call...I am selfishly hoping you will keep wanting to study and post here even if you aren't always preaching!
The beginning of this text, "It was reported that he was at home..." has a comforting quality...there was someplace called "home" for Jesus. It is not the punchline to the story, but a phrase to savor for a moment.
All the external obstacles to wellness were apparently not serious deterents for these able bodied friends on behalf of their friend. But they are in high contrast to many others. It seems that we have so many obstacles to wellness...our attitudes, habits of thought, patterns of negativity. The obstacles which prevent lives of joy have to be moved out of the way. Mostly the obstacles are interior fears. Jesus' perfect love cast out that fear in the paralyzed one...sins forgiven, sinews, muscles, tendons and ligaments released. The healing energy surges through him. The man walks back into his own life. I do love this account!
Aslanclan
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 7:38:51 AM
"In the name of Jesus Christ, you are forgiven." This is the pronouncement that the one presiding at the table in the UMC makes to the gathered community following a confession and before the eucharist. Interesting to me, is that the forgiven community makes the same statement in return. Until a few weeks ago, I always took that personally. My congregation pronouncing my absolution. Lately, I've been thinking that there is more to it. The congregation, exercising its authority for ministry bestowed in baptism, is forgiving the CHURCH for its failure to be the CHURCH.
The CHURCH as institution has inflicted pain and injustice and is crippled as a result. It needs to hear ABSOLUTION to be empowered to get up and take its place as a healthy institution.
My own local part of the body of Christ, needs to hear these words extended by the individual believers to itself as a broken body.
Any ideas about how to help the Corporate and Local body of Christ hear the pronouncement "In the name of Jesus Christ, your sins are forgiven"?
Just a thought or two based on another posting. Thanks.
MAR in TX
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 8:52:07 AM
"they could not bring him to Jesus because of the crowd." Wow! Who or what is the crowd in our lives that prevents us from bringing others to Jesus, prevents us from coming close to Jesus? [peers, crowded calendar, other priorities?](is it religion or the church itself?)
paralysis, crowd, roof = all obstacles that were overcome (desparate measures for desparate / determined people like the leprous man in last weeks lesson = filled with courage, humility, & faith in order to approach Jesus for healing)
Thinking out loud Carolyn in ME
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 8:54:10 AM
Eric - may God bless you this Sunday; it's bound to be difficult.
As for the grammar police, and please take this for the playfulness it's meant to be ... ... "loan" is a noun. "Lend" is a verb. One makes a loan, or one lends something; one does not loan something.
And speaking of police, I lost my temper a bit at Ad. council Sunday afternoon - the "proper police" showed their stuff and said, "We have a policy about what is and isn't to go on the altar." It was in response to some pictures we'd taken of our Super Soul Sunday offering of shoes and soup on and around the table. I said, "policy, shmolicy ... it's entirely appropriate to adorn the altar and make it beautiful in any way we can, and it's entirely appropriate to lay our gifts on the table, because this is an act of our worship, our devotion and we're giving it to God."
I'd had it with the proper police objecting to so much - and to the fact that only one person ever mentioned anything to me about properness this whole year and a half I've been here. and, for that matter, that I've been trying to address it through a Bible study and none of the 4 women attending the Bible study object to my worship methods in the first place. OK - now that I've sounded off,
My point is this: policies are paralyzing. I recall the time the women who change the paraments and set up for communion wanted to lay the red cloth on the table at a different angle. This was simply because the red cloth is sewn somewhat differently than the others and the red isn't visible from the congregation. She wanted to lay it cross-wise so the red would show. Officer Proper (who has a snappish way she's not fully aware of) snapped, "It's not proper." It made the first woman kind of anxious and she told me and said, "I just do what I'm told," when I asked why it wasn't proper.
For crying out loud!!!!!!!! The worship has been dead around here for years!!!!! What are we more concerned with - and what do we worship - the wood of the table or the linen on the cloth, or the Living God who said to the woman at the well in response to her question about the proper mountain to worship - "the hour is coming and now is when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth."
I'm struck by the phrase in v. 12, "We've never seen anything like this!" what a contrast in reactions the witnesses to the miracle (amazed and glorifying God) to our stodgy congregants saying "We've never done it that way before."
To her credit, Officer Proper said, "well, maybe we need to change the policy." and I was backed up by our lay leader and UMW president, and PPR chair. It felt good - especially to have support when I was angry.
A long post - thanks for listening (or, reading, anyhow)
Sally in GA
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 9:13:20 AM
Nancy in WI - I, too, would get impatient with folks who are able to get around just fine all week but can't attend church. To be sure, there are some who probably really could if it were important enough. You didn't ask for it, but here are some things I've observed when the paralysis is not spiritual, but physically real.
Here are some very real factors that paralyze: 1) the pews are just too difficult and hard for arthritic bones to sit in for an hour - this is very true; I've often sat in pews that I, myself, feel sore after getting up and I don't even have arthritis. 2) depression - especially after someone dies. Many have told me that the most difficult church service, besides the funeral, someone attends is the first time back after a death. 3) incontinence. It's embarassing to worry about soiling your Depends. 4) hearing problems - how boring is it to just sit there not being able to understand a thing that goes on? 5) not being able to follow some music or the order of worship - from vision problems, or strokes, or whatever, many can't process the information fast enough to keep up - and that's frustrating to them, even though no one blames them 6) can't stand up/kneel - even in the midst of longtime friends, who wouldn't care a bit, some feel embarassed that they can't stand to sing, or kneel to receive communion and 7) accessibility - I've seen hair salons more accessible than some churches.
What can we do to de-paralyze someone, to make them feel more welcome?
Sally
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 11:30:51 AM
Our Brief Order for Confession and Forgiveness concludes with the Presiding Minister saying:
Almighty god, in his mercy, has given his Son to die for us and, for his sake, forgives us all our sins. As a called and ordained minister of the Church of Christ, and by his authority, I therefore declare to you the entire forgiveness of all your sins, in the name of the Father, and of the + Son, and of the Holy Spirit. Amen
Hearing that as a parishioner used to bother me because I thought, who is s/he that s/he can forgive my sins? Then I looked deeper, and saw and heard what it really says. By HIS authority we DECLARE the forgiveness of sins.
In my fourth year at seminary I wrote a Comprehensive Paper (something like a thesis) called "Pastoral Leadership of Gospel-Centred Worship" in which I explored how the church's Sunday assembly for worship forms and transforms our faith through the proclamation of the Gospel in Word and Sacrament. I looked at the historical roots of our worship forms, at the Emmaus story for the relation of Word and meal that has become our worship practice, how our worship form us in faith for mission, basically looking at how our worship communicates the Gospel so that we can be formed as a people of faith in mission. At my defense it was pointed out that I failed to make any mention of Confession and Forgiveness in our worship and how that proclaims he Gospel in a nutshell.
Which is easier to say, "Your sins are forgiven," or to say, "Stand up and take your mat and walk"? This is the blasphemy that will ultimately get Jesus condemned to death at the end of the story (Mk 14.64). Ben Witherington says: "The question is not only which is easier to say, but easier to do. Obviously it would be easier to say a person's sins were forgiven because there was no objective wasy of telling if this was true or not, unlike healing a cripple, where the evidence would either stand up for and support the pronouncement or not. But in regard to which was easier to do, without question it was the healing of the body. Various OT prophets and others had been able to perform such miracles but only God could send away sins."
Mark's portrayal is christologically focused, showing the divine character and authority of Jesus, otherwise the charge of blasphemy would have been correct. Jesus said, "Son, your sins are forgiven." He didn't say, "The Lord forgives your sins" which the priests could say. He didn't say "by his authority, I declare to you the forgiveness of all your sins" the way I do on a Sunday morning. He said "your sins are forgiven" the way only God can.
Shalom: Tom in Ontario
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 11:45:10 AM
Sally -- I know, I know. I always correct my kids when they make the same error and then, as I was typing it, I thought, "What the hell? 'Lent' looks too proper!"
Thank you all for your words of support.
Eric in KS (still focusing on taking up that darned mat!)
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 11:49:58 AM
Ha! Sally, just for fun I went to check on "loan" as verb at dictionary.com and this is what I found... both the American Heritage and Webster's Unabridged include "loan" as a transitive verb with "loaned" as the past tense. And the A.H. includes the following comment:
"Usage Note: The verb loan is well established in American usage and cannot be considered incorrect. The frequent objections to the form by American grammarians may have originated from a provincial deference to British critics, who long ago labeled the usage a typical Americanism. Loan is, however, used to describe only physical transactions, as of money or goods; for figurative transactions, lend is correct: Distance lends enchantment. The allusions lend the work a classical tone."
So there you are ... let's both tell Officer Proper to go fly a kite!
Blessings, Eric in KS
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 12:32:48 PM
I see this text as a fulfillment of the Isaiah passage (Is 43:19) in which the Lord says "I am about to do a new thing..." Jesus is doing a radically new thing when he takes the authority to forgive the man's sins. Again, the scribes question this. They are so used to their old, long held perceptions, experiences, and understandings about God. When through his Son, God does something new like forgiving sins and granting physical healing, those who are stuck with their old paradigms cannot understand or accept it. This seems to parallel exactly the situation that Sally describes with Officer Proper. In Jesus there is a pradigm shift and a "crack in history." It's a new day and a new way. Thank God for a breath of fresh air.
Creature Wayne
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 12:58:43 PM
I am struck with verse 5 that says, "When Jesus SAW their faith..." Can Jesus SEE our faith? What do we do that shows our faith?
I also like the idea (I think was mentioned above) that it was the man's friends who had faith. There are times when we need other people to have faith for us. I remember going through a minor operation and I was so jittery and upset that I had a hard time praying or having faith. But I found great strength in the fact that my husband and friends prayed and had faith for me. Sometimes we are too paralyzed to have faith, and we need others.
Eric, may God bless you and your congregation this Sunday.
DGinNYC
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 2:00:07 PM
Two weeks ago Jesus healed. Last week Jesus made the leper clean. This week he forgives sin. There's a sermon in here somewhere. lp in CO
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 2:18:27 PM
My church doesn't even own paraments! So...I don't have to deal with the "proper Police." :-) Eric, just "take up your mat and follow Him." I hope that you will still be a contributor to this site. You have so much to give. Blessings to you! lp in CO
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 2:40:39 PM
To the contributor with the fancy idea of burning last year's Palm Sunday crosses for Ash Wednesday. First, be aware that they do not burn easily. You need lots more heat than a match. Second, for the sake of safety burn them in something like a brazier or one of those Japanese things. Above all DO NOT BURN THEM PUBLICLY, during a service - you may either fail or burn the Church down. Even after burning they need to be pulverized with a mortor and pestle. John in New York
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 2:42:08 PM
MAR in TX,
Thank you for your observations on the absolution part of our Eucharist liturgy. I have one person who gets bent out of shape when I chose to use the Table liturgy's version of confession & absolution because it's too "Catholic" -- by which he means RC, not catholic in the universal sense. Don't know whether I'll go this direction this week, or not, but your thoughts have given me some food for thought on the subject that will certainly be useful at some point!
Eric, I add my thanks to the many voices already expressing theirs for the many times your thoughts have enriched my preaching. As you "take up your rug" and depart, may God bless you and your family on the next phase of your ministry and life.
StudentPastor in KS
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 4:14:56 PM
OK ... let me way in on the subject of palm burning, something I do an a yearly basis.
First -- no liturgy. I do it some time after the Last Sunday after Epiphany which is when I have invited the congregation to bring back any palms they have from last Palm Sunday.
Second -- a match works just fine. If the palms have dried out for a year, all you have to do is crush them up fairly well into 6" or so pieces. Take a 3 lb. coffee tin, pop three holes about the perimeter of the base with a "church key", put a couple of hand fulls of the palms in, and set them on fire with a fire-place match or one of those long butane fire-place lighters (the latter is better as you may have to relight a time or two).
Have a long metal spoon or other metal object handy to stir the palms occasionally as they burn. Add more palms as they burn down. Eventually you will be left with smoldering palm stuff. Go away, let it smolder for a while.
Once its burnt out, find a fine screen mesh strainer and sift the ashes through it. You'll be left with a sufficient amount of a nice powdery ash you can use on the Day of Ashes.
Some people like to add a couple of drops of olive oil to the ashes ... I tried this once and it just makes a mess in my opinion. The dry ashes work just fine. I have a little cosmetic jar of some sort (I have no idea what was in it originally) that just fits my thumb and holds about two tablespoons of packed ashes -- find something like that and you "sitting pretty."
A hint -- after you "ashed" a bunch of people, you will have a very blackened thumb. Have a bowl with a wedge of lemon in it handy, together with a cruet of water and a towel. Rub your thumb on the lemon wedge, rinse with the water, and dry. The lemon juice works very nicely to cut the ash and clean it from your skin.
That's it ... every helpful "Hint from Heloise" I can think of for Ash Wednesday preparation.
Anybody want my recipe for an absolutely smashing "new fire" for an Easter Vigil???
Blessings, Eric in KS
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 4:15:44 PM
"Way in"? Shouldn't that be "weigh in"?
Officer Proper is gonna get me for sure!
Eric
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 5:14:52 PM
Sally in Ga--Someone once quipped that the seven last words of the church are "We've never done it that way before."
Aslanclan
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 5:33:55 PM
Eric,
I read into that first sentence, let me (all the) way in... lol
Something tells me that you need to hear this as much as I do, so here goes: "Your sins are forgiven."
Michelle
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 5:35:39 PM
Hey, all,
Did you realize that the verb form for "And he stood up" is passive? In other words, he was raised up, just like Jesus in the resurrection!
Michelle
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 5:41:08 PM
One more short posting. If you're going to burn palms for ashes, do it outside. They can make quite a stench!
Also, the tradition is to burn the palms on the Tuesday before Ash Wednesday, which "lends" the meaning to the name, Shrove Tuesday.
Michelle
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 8:53:16 PM
Eric
God bless you, buddy. Your wisdom and your ability to laugh (even through pain) have sustained me many a week. Even under the best of circumstances, it's hard to leave.
Shalom. My prayers are with you
Revgilmer in texarkana
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 9:33:55 PM
I often find that the complex or most difficult decisions come down to what is good, but what is better. And so often, I choose only what is good!
It is good to heal the paralytic, but it is better to heal his sin, (ie; that which keeps him from loving as God desired in his creation of us.)
Many Christians do not realise that these decisions still carry the emphasis of good and evil. To do what is good and not what is better is often the inclination to evil that resides in us. A part of the Christian baptismal promise is to renounces evil. It is not so easy, when it presents as a multiple moral choice between that which is good enough, and that which is better.
Jesus wants those who witness, to recognise that to choose to do the better (ie; forgive his sins) will cost far more, than any miracle of healing a paralytic.
There are some very powerful dynamics of relationship contained in this passage of Mark, and I am always conscious that Mark seems to use seemingly simple physical events to illustrate very complex spiritual insights.
I find this a very stirring incident, with a great deal happening.
Have a great week everyone,
Regards, KGB.
Date: 2/18/2003
Time: 9:37:17 PM
Oops! I meant to say, I have found that the most difficult decisions "don't" come down to what is good, but to what is better to do.
It is not necessarily between good and bad, but between good and better. Better being the harder choice and always the more costly to my own well-being.
I hope this clarifies my statements. Sorry about that.
Regards, KGB
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 3:54:16 AM
To PH in OH. Your questions are truly piercing: "Who cared enough to carry us into the church? Who do we care about enough to carry them into church?" I will carry these thoughts into my lesson preparations for this week. Thank you. Thanks be to God. And, thank all of you for your thoughts. I've not participated in reading the contributions for a very busy while. I appreciate everyone's ponderings. They truly do "encourage and build up." Thanks to all. This morning I am reminded of what I have been missing. JS in SW
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 6:12:20 AM
Here's a humerous illustration with alittle truth to it: Hard questions: Why do we drive on parkways and park on driveways? What's so French about French fries? Why is the third hand on the watch called the second hand? Why does "fat chance" and "slim chance" mean the same thing? Why are they called "stands" when they are made for sitting? Why is it called "after dark" when it really is "after light"? Howcome abbreviated is such a long word? "Which is easier, to say to the paralytic, ‘Your sins are forgiven,’ or to say, ‘Stand up and take your mat and walk’?" Lots more at http://home.twcny.rr.com/lyndale/epiphany7.htm
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 8:44:26 AM
2:1 When he returned to Capernaum after some days, it was reported that he was at home.
HELP!
Whose home? Jesus' or Peter's mother-in-law?
tom in ga
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 9:05:36 AM
To all who have given advice on the how to burn palm crosses - thanks. This will be the third year that I have done it, quite successfully, usually outside our house back door sometime during our shrove Tuesday pancake party.
It's fun to do, and the kids love being a part of it, but I guess I wanted to 'lend' some gravity to it by dignifying the activity with some words ...
Any ideas ?
Still Rev Ev in Bev UK
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 9:54:55 AM
Thanks to all for your much valued insights. Someone mentioned that here Jesus is doing a new thing by, for the first time, taking the authority to forgive sins. Isn't it interesting that the healing in this story is only an afterthought (after the debate begins). These four friends go through all this effort to bring the paralytic to Jesus and all he says is, "Son, your sins are forgiven." It strikes me that's not exactly what the friends were looking for. Weren't they looking for a healing and not just some religious talk. I would be a little upset.
They may have heard it differently of course, but it seems to point to a difference between us and them that may need to be addressed. Not sure where I'm going with this. What is the relationship between healing and forgiveness? Which do we most want? Which do we expect? Today, if we say, "Your sins are forgiven" not more than an eyebrow is raised. (Although actual forgiveness is certainly another matter) Why is that?
Some random musings, Jeff in AR
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 9:57:36 AM
Oops! I guess I should subscribe again. It seems my questions are addressed in the resource section, at least from what I've seen in the excerpts on the main page.
Jeff in AR
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 10:05:02 AM
Home?
The NIB overview of ch. 2 & 3 of Mark includes this comment: "Jesus' return to Capernaum, which is now described as his home...." So perhaps the "home" reference is to the whole town, not the particular house where this event occurs.
Blessings, Eric in KS
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 10:34:50 AM
To Michelle And make sure it is not windy either!
John in New York
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 11:03:44 AM
Eric in KS,
Perhaps you can speak of the wholeness (healing) you have found in your ministry at that place you're leaving and what paralyzed you before in ministry when you first got there; now you're able to take up your mat. I won't use such a period of time, rather picture only any given Sunday when all in the congregation come in with some sort of paralysis- physical or spiritual- and are able to meet Jesus' healing in Word and Sacrament. -AEA
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 12:00:06 PM
To those messing with ashes, one thing to be sure not to do is mix them with water. My predecessor did just that and literally branded the foreheads of those who received the imposition of ashes that day. Oil really is the best or just dry. Thanks, Michelle. I think those words about forgiveness are needed by us all. Kushner's book, How Good Do We Have to Be? offers an excellent insight on guilt and shame and forgiveness and acceptance. Deke of the North
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 12:32:23 PM
Eric in KS,
Thank you for the quote from the NIB. But what do you do with the first two verses:
When he returned to Capernaum after some days, it was reported that he was at home. So many gathered around that there was no longer room for them, not even in front of the door; and he was speaking the word to them.
The "door" reflects a "house" or "home" not the whole "town."
It seems to me that there is a reference to a "place". If Peter's home was his headquarters during his ministry in Capernaum, then I would imagine this would be the same house. But I don't know.
Any more help is always appreciated.
tom in ga
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 12:42:42 PM
I'm struck by the fact that everyone who saw the man lowered into the room that day probably saw a poor paralysed man, who needed physical healing above all. Jesus saw more than that - he saw someone who needed forgiveness. I wonder how people who have visible, physical handicaps hear these verses. Maybe its a relief to be seen not just as a person broken in body, different from everyone else, but broken inside, just like everyone else. Lisa in Central IL
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 1:04:14 PM
On a previous occassion in preaching this text, I focused on the faith of the man's friends and entitled my sermon, "With A Little Help From Our Friends" ... (without specifically referencing the song...). The exciting thing about that service was that God stopped me as I was getting ready for the service that Sunday morning. Much of my focus was about what it was to be the church and the gift and responsibility of intercession. God said, don't just talk about it -- do it! So, I spent the Sunday School hour going to the classes and writing down specific prayer requests (that they volunteered out loud). Then I wrote each prayer request (plus additional ones from my prayer list) -- one each -- on a 3x5 index card. I lined the altar rail with the cards and called for people to come forward at the close of the service to be the "Carrier" for another. They prayed for that person/situation/card at the altar and then committed to pray the entire next week. It was a meaningful service and an exciting way of remembering that God still interrupts my plans with some Divine Direction! Shalom, RevAmy
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 1:18:31 PM
I'm guessing that it was not a common practice to dig a hole in the roof of a house. The phrase that keeps coming into my head is, "We've never done it that way before." This seems like a good passage to talk about creativity in discipleship, creativity in faith and action, the change that will allow some of our communities to heal, rather than remain stagnate. As Christians we need to have a trust in Christ's healing power that is deep enough and strong enough that challenges us to be the change we want to see in the world, rather than adapting to change when we are forced to. Early thoughts. What do you think? Angelic Residue, OR
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 1:18:41 PM
I'm guessing that it was not a common practice to dig a hole in the roof of a house. The phrase that keeps coming into my head is, "We've never done it that way before." This seems like a good passage to talk about creativity in discipleship, creativity in faith and action, the change that will allow some of our communities to heal, rather than remain stagnate. As Christians we need to have a trust in Christ's healing power that is deep enough and strong enough that challenges us to be the change we want to see in the world, rather than adapting to change when we are forced to. Early thoughts. What do you think? Angelic Residue, OR
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 1:18:49 PM
I'm guessing that it was not a common practice to dig a hole in the roof of a house. The phrase that keeps coming into my head is, "We've never done it that way before." This seems like a good passage to talk about creativity in discipleship, creativity in faith and action, the change that will allow some of our communities to heal, rather than remain stagnate. As Christians we need to have a trust in Christ's healing power that is deep enough and strong enough that challenges us to be the change we want to see in the world, rather than adapting to change when we are forced to. Early thoughts. What do you think? Angelic Residue, OR
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 1:20:18 PM
Sorry about that...my mouse got stuck!
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 1:47:14 PM
I can't help wondering about this paralyzed man. What if he had been able to walk into the house, pushing himself through the crowd in order for Jesus to heal some other illness. In this case, you may have seen faith at work in him, or you may have seen an arrogant person seeing if Jesus could take care of his dis-ease.
But in this story, we have a man who cannot move, who cannot walk, who has absolutely no way to get into the house to see Jesus and to plead for his mercy and healing. He has to be completely passive. We don't even know if this man can speak. He is at the total mercy of his friends. It was their decision, it was their faith that made them climb the ladder, to lift the man to the roof, to tear open the roof, and to lower the man before Jesus. What is this lifting and lowering we call faith? What is this love that brings this man before Jesus?
There are times when I can't move, when I can't speak, when I am in need of friends to carry me, to lift and to lower, to pray and to love, and to hold me before Christ for healing/forgiveness.
What is the difference (if any) between an active and a passive dis-eased person? Does it make a difference?
tom in ga
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 1:58:02 PM
From the Scriptures we cannot say whose house "at home" meant. It is possible again that it was Peter's. It is also possible that it was a house to which both Mary and Jesus had moved after the death of Joseph, as Capernaum was the growing city with opportunities for employment, etc. I believe the idiom translated "at home" is literally "in the house" and therefore would not mean the entire town.
Michelle
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 2:04:18 PM
Rev Ev in Bev UK,
I have some questions and answers used during the burning of the ashes for a Sunday School educational experience, but it's not really liturgical. There are some things in it you could adapt. However, it is an entire page, so I decided to post it under the gospel heading for Ash Wednesday rather than here. Hopefully someone will find it helpful.
Michelle
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 2:09:24 PM
Another 'weighing' in on imposing ashes. Before that part of the service, I invite folks up to be anointed with oil for healing in any area of their lives. This is preceeded by an explanation that healing is not the same as curing. (The Book of Worship for the UMC has an excellent explanation that I've adapted for this). I use olive oil and have a small amount in a large sea shell to use for the anointing. I also put the ashes in a sea shell. I like this connection to Baptismal imagery.
RevSophia in Central PA
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 2:15:30 PM
I am struck by the fact that there were a large number of people listening to Jesus preach (hearing the Word) who were not observant enough of those around them to make way for one who needed to come to Jesus. The crowd seemed content just where they were, and therefore those who knew how badly this one on the stretcher needed to get to Jesus were forced to find another process to get to Jesus that sidestepped those who had already heard Jesus.
It does remind one of trying to find ways to bring new faces into the church, when the old faces are a bit intransigent about how things must be.
Just another Tom
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 2:16:06 PM
I am struck by the fact that there were a large number of people listening to Jesus preach (hearing the Word) who were not observant enough of those around them to make way for one who needed to come to Jesus. The crowd seemed content just where they were, and therefore those who knew how badly this one on the stretcher needed to get to Jesus were forced to find another process to get to Jesus that sidestepped those who had already heard Jesus.
It does remind one of trying to find ways to bring new faces into the church, when the old faces are a bit intransigent about how things must be.
Just another Tom
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 2:44:12 PM
Jeff in AR,
Thank-you for clarifying what I was attempting to say in my previous post.
Forgiveness today, like so much spirituality, has become just so much superficial expression. When we determine that forgiveness is in essence the grace of God to move on, we might see that Jesus was performing the better thing, by saying, "Your sins are forgiven". Yet we who are so contained and controlled by the material and physical world, (what Paul calls the flesh), are unable to appreciate the depth of what occurs when we are actively involved in forgiveness. Can many in America and Australia forgive the terrorists for the atrocities they have performed? It is not so easy, and yet Jesus reminds us in this event that it is even more important than healing paralysis.
We see the healing as such a "good" thing, but in actual fact, it was the forgiveness of sin, which was the better. "Which is easier/better" Jesus says. "Your sins are forgiven, or take up your mat and walk."
We say "forgiveness" because we have no idea of the depth of what we are involved in. Our spiritual capacity to love can only be fully expressed when we forgive all who have ever wronged us, or hurt us. These are the events that paralyse the soul, and of course the body.
Which is easier?
Forgiveness just rolls off our tongue like water, but the truth is, we hardly ever do it properly. Seven times seventy - remember.
We do what is good, but not what is best. The consequence of recognising this, is to see that despite 2000 years of Christianity, we are still inclined toward the evil side of our humanity.
I guess the bottom line is, Were the people amazed at the forgiveness of Christ, or the healing of the paralysed man?? And where are we?
Regards, KGB
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 5:34:59 PM
I have been reading your comments here now for some weeks and find them invaluable to help focus and challenge my mind.This story is highly applicable to where our wide parish is at. There is just so much here, that one could take different aspects of Mark's story and preach on it for weeks!!! "What does it take to get people to Jesus. If it takes tearing down the existing structure (the roof)to get people moving, then lets get stuck in. A radically new approach may be needed in this day and age." Also what paralyzes a church? It can even be the leader(minister, vicar.) Ponderings. Rev Andy from NZ.
Date: 2/19/2003
Time: 6:57:26 PM
Rev Andy from NZ:
Now, you are meddling! A new approach! But we have always done it this way before. The only hole we have in the roof is a leak because the church is dying and there is not enough money to fix the roof.
Perhaps the house is not a home. Perhaps the house is the NT church (Van Bogard Dunn). You are either in the house or outside it. Sometimes people have to fight to get in (be a part of) a congregation. How many churches are so ingrown (i.e. we only like those who are here) that visitors are not welcome? As we meet for worship, who is in the house and who is outside the house? Yes, more meddling!
PH in OH
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 6:24:53 AM
Another thought on the subject of Jesus' "Home". Whether it was a house owned or rented by Jesus and/or Mary, or whether this was Peter's house, he considered it was home. And that meant it was his own home whose roof was being torn up! Jesus was so much more focused on the needs of the paralyzed man that he ignored the damage to his own home! -- Mike in Maryland
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 6:45:51 AM
Eric - You put a lot more into it than I; I was just remembering my 9th-grade English teacher's words. Of course, she was kind of weird in the Officer-Proper sort of way, anyhow. You made me laugh! She was the one who said that the word "that" doesn't refer to people. I hear it all the time, though, as in "The people that worship policy above God" should be "the people WHO worship policy above God." Some people must not have very many worries to have the energy to worry about such things.
Anyways (or is it "anyway"), thanks; I needed a chuckle this morning.
Sally in GA
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 7:04:50 AM
OK, now that I've had my fun this morning, down to work.
I'm going to take a more exploratory approach. I'm going to ask folks which they are, the people blocking the door so that someone can't come in and get healed, the friends who refused to be daunted by the crowd and find another way, or the paralytic who's prevented from entering the door. Of course, each has its own subset of reasons & circumstances. I don't ususally do linear sermons, and though there are three points, the main theme will be (I hope) an invitation to examine our hearts and motives. All are there to see Jesus, and "all were amazed and glorified God." Therefore, there's hope for all of us - we're all in the presence of healing and redemption and we've never seen anything like this!
Title: "You've Never Seen Anything Like This" - looks good on the marquee, if I do say so myself.
I really feel that this pericope and this altar policy circumstance is a serendipitous invitation to address "the altar policy" pastorally and scripturally. Thankfully, no one's feelings are on the line personally.
And - we had a difficult, but productive evangelism meeting last night, so I'm rejoicing!!! I'm trying to get them to get in touch with WHY they're Christians and have commissioned them to talk about it in their SS classes and women's groups and just conversation with other congregants. I do believe the evangelism will grow from that once folks can claim and embrace their beliefs. In other words, to start evangelism right here in church.
Thanks for reading! Sally in GA
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 7:05:27 AM
OK, now that I've had my fun this morning, down to work.
I'm going to take a more exploratory approach. I'm going to ask folks which they are, the people blocking the door so that someone can't come in and get healed, the friends who refused to be daunted by the crowd and find another way, or the paralytic who's prevented from entering the door. Of course, each has its own subset of reasons & circumstances. I don't ususally do linear sermons, and though there are three points, the main theme will be (I hope) an invitation to examine our hearts and motives. All are there to see Jesus, and "all were amazed and glorified God." Therefore, there's hope for all of us - we're all in the presence of healing and redemption and we've never seen anything like this!
Title: "You've Never Seen Anything Like This" - looks good on the marquee, if I do say so myself.
I really feel that this pericope and this altar policy circumstance is a serendipitous invitation to address "the altar policy" pastorally and scripturally. Thankfully, no one's feelings are on the line personally.
And - we had a difficult, but productive evangelism meeting last night, so I'm rejoicing!!! I'm trying to get them to get in touch with WHY they're Christians and have commissioned them to talk about it in their SS classes and women's groups and just conversation with other congregants. I do believe the evangelism will grow from that once folks can claim and embrace their beliefs. In other words, to start evangelism right here in church.
Thanks for reading! Sally in GA
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 7:08:42 AM
What is this paralyzing dis-ease that cripples this man?
Is it guilt (if he had sinned, then perhaps)? Was it his pride? Was it his selfishness or willfulness?
What do we need when we cannot act ourselves? Is it Job's friends, or these friends who lead us to healing grace.
Isaiah speaks of lethargy. For this man, it just simply may be sloth (God never answers my prayers, so why bother).
Where do we find ourselves. Are we the friends, are are we the one who needs to be released from our crippling dis-ease?
tom in ga
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 7:17:38 AM
IP in CO - one of my first churches didn't have paraments when I first came there. Someone then bought a set in memory of someone just because they thought it would be a nice thing to do.
That church's Officer Proper literally tried to take over the church by getting up to teach Sunday school and then continuing on until I came (it was a circuit and they were the 2nd church that morning). As soon as he saw me, he took the paraments off and started testifying about "man's law" and "God's law" and "false prophets" and "wolves in lambs' clothing" and people who are trying to lure the sheep into hell. At first, I thought he was finishing the Sunday school lesson (it was all in the sanctuary), like they'd just gone over time a little bit. Then I realized it was ME!!! Turns out he was a member of a (they call themselves Christian) alliance and he'd targeted this church, having been offended first by me, and then by the paraments.
Proper is as proper does.
Sally
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 7:27:16 AM
Ashers - actually, I find mixing them with water works just fine. Rinses right off. Don't make it too wet, though, or you get ashen sludge. Just enough to help it adhere. My thumb isn't moist enough to impose (what a word) them dry.
Sally (talkative today, ain't I?)
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 8:22:30 AM
Lots of good thoughts expressed long before my contribution hits your screen... I entitled this sermon "Razing the Roof". So many illustrations come to mind. Having lived in Egypt for a year I saw what it means to have a "whole town" crowded up against a door. You should have seen the trains in Cairo, people so crowded in there they were literally hanging out windows, with not a few finally just crawling up onto the top of the traincar. NO WAY could anyone get through a crowd like that!
Then I think of how we think of our church buildings as "home" but put the picture-perfectness of the building ahead of the needs of people who come. We have a "nesting" congregation of Brazilians who meet in our church building. They are a lively group of spirited worshipers. But the carpet near the door where they regularly enter has become soiled by drips of coffee and whatnot, not by wanton irresponsibility. Rather than get upset that the facilities are a little dirty, we rejoice at the koinonia that is being built among them, and among us who relate to them.
I think about paralysis -- and depression. King David, after his affair with Bathsheba, and even after being confronted by Nathan and immediately confessing his sin and hearing Nathan's words of absolution, "the Lord has forgiven your sin", continues to live for sometime in a depressed state, Ps. 55, 22, saying his bones feel crushed, he's poured out like water, out of joint, his heart feels like water. Depression is sometimes called "frozen rage", which can paralyze us, sometimes rendering us "unable" to get out of bed. I've heard it affects 1 out of about 15 people. Sometimes the guilt is true (as in David's case) and sometimes it is false (for ex. when someone who has been abused thinks it's her/his own fault). But it either case it paralyzes, often because we end up holding in a grudge, toward others, toward God. We have the choice to hang onto it and continue in depression or to let it go, which is easier when we have been given "permission". Jesus says "Your sins are forgiven." I'm guessing that took a few minutes to sink in and undo whatever it was that was paralyzing this guy...but when he let go, he was healed.
I'm guessing many folks in town knew this paralytic. Capernaum isn't that big. I wonder if it ws hard/ humbling/ humiliating to acknowledge his new station in life...
L'Anni in Atlanta (soon to move to the Hague)
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 8:26:52 AM
I want to use this passage (and Isaiah) to reclaim the tradition of confession. Our paralytic, in a 1st century mindset, has become immobilized by sin and in need of forgiveness. Jesus does that and our man is able to go forward. The paralytic, though he does not speak a confession, confesses by the very nature of his entrance into the presence of Jesus- immobile, exposed for all the world to see, the center of attention and want and need.
In many mainline Liberal churches, we have dropped the idea of confession because it now comes loaded with centuries of guilt, manipulation and abuse by church leaders and institutions. In my church, we no longer have a 'Prayer of Confession' but pray a watered down 'Prayer of the Day.' I want to suggest that confession is (to coin a phrase) good for the soul. My main point will be that confession, in and of itself, is nothing... but confession, tied to forgiveness is healing and moves us toward grace.
We have given up on confession for the wrong reason-we have lost confession's power by allowed ourselves to stay in the confessing moment with its shame, guilt and pain (not to mention how exposed and vulnerable one is if we truely confess to our sins... as if we were dangling from ropes before a large crowd as we are lowered from the ceiling for all the world to see)without moving toward what Jesus offers in this passage- healing for that suffering and forgiveness.
Maybe a good sermon title is 'Graceful Entrances.'
Well, I am sure you get my point... I'll cease to prattle on... someone is knocking at the office door! (At least they aren't digging through the roof and lowering themselves inside)
TB in MN
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 9:55:35 AM
Someone mentioned the seven last words of the church, "But we've never done it that way..." I once read in another church's newsletter the seven words of a healthy church: "Let's try it and see what happens..." For what it's worth....REVJAW
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 9:59:28 AM
A hopeful handful of thoughts on this passage...
(1) this story provides a wonderful "door" (ha-ha) for talking about issues of "accessibility" in churches (not only spiritual, but physical access)--I'll never forget Rev. Ed Kail (Humboldt, IA, now and formerly at Saint Paul, KCMO) referrring to those of us at a gathering as "temporarily able-bodied"....food for thought.
(2) each week, I ask for guidance not only for how to preach a passage, but how to PRAY it, too--usually as a Time of Commitment following the sermon--for this passage, it seems one way is to conduct a "guided meditation" on "where are you in the story?" (in the crowd, one of the protesters, one of the friends, the paralyzed one, the home-owner!, etc.)
(3) an illustration which connects to this story: I'm taking the "First Responder" training to become part of the Emergency Medical Services in our area. At the heart of the training is the fundamental principle of what our role is: to get the person with illness/injury to the care they need, we are the first link in the chain that leads to "definitive care"--simply put, our job is to get people to the hospital. Using the example of the four friends, we are called, as Christians to be "FAITH RESPONDERS"--remembering that "the Church is not a showplace for saints, but a hospital for sinners.
TK in OK
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 10:15:31 AM
Other thoughts on preaching this passage.
Two that will work well for all the "3-pointers" out there: (1) The "Fab-Four Faith-Friends"... -saw the need -found the source -did what it took
(2) Being a "Faith Responder" means 3 things: -be compassionate -be creative -be courageous in bringing people to Jesus
"Build it and they will come" may not be true--but if Jesus is there, they will come . . . not always in the ways we expect; hopefully because of us, but sometimes in spite of us.
There was also a song back during "Desert Storm" days, about a loved-one's longed-for return, had the words, "I don't care how you get here, just get here if you can"--do we really care as much HOW people get to Jesus, just so they do?
TK in OK
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 10:16:25 AM
Other thoughts on preaching this passage.
Two that will work well for all the "3-pointers" out there: (1) The "Fab-Four Faith-Friends"... -saw the need -found the source -did what it took
(2) Being a "Faith Responder" means 3 things: -be compassionate -be creative -be courageous in bringing people to Jesus
"Build it and they will come" may not be true--but if Jesus is there, they will come . . . not always in the ways we expect; hopefully because of us, but sometimes in spite of us.
There was also a song back during "Desert Storm" days, about a loved-one's longed-for return, had the words, "I don't care how you get here, just get here if you can"--do we really care as much HOW people get to Jesus, just so they do?
TK in OK
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 10:26:59 AM
There's an opening on the roof, the door provides an opening, the healing words of Jesus provides the opening for both the man's body and "soul" to become well and move out the door. (I suspect the crowds parted so he could walk past them!)
Some present, however, were completely shut, shut down to what was the thrilling wholeness they saw flowing to the man on the mat. Mostly I feel compassion and pity on those who are so closed. I suppose there are huge gobs of submerged fear and hurt inside them which clogs all the openings.
We spend so much time trying to feel safe.
Aslanclan
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 10:29:12 AM
Nail Bender, where are you?
I was in a counselling course once. There was a woman taking the course who was in her sixties. She was nice, but she seemed reserved, timid, and even a little rigid. One day we were doing this exercise, remembering feelings and issues from our childhood. Suddenly this woman could not breath, and she broke out in a real sweat. The teacher got permission from her to explore what was going on. After she agreed, they worked through what she was experiencing. It turned out she was an only child, and her mother (who was now dead) never wanted her. When she was born it was a dry birth, and in conscious and unconscious ways she had received the message that she was never wanted. The injunction was; "you would be more loved if you did not exist." This woman had lived her life paying off her mom for being born, trying to get her mom to love her. She must have carried a lot of guilt around just for being alive. After she processed some of this with the teacher, she stood up underneath the ceiling fan and took in big gulps of air, twirling around with her arms lifted up, in a way she never would have done before. She had a look of life and joy on her face. I sat back and said to myself; "This woman has just been born again - literally." When she was not able to breath and was breaking out in a sweat, she was in some way, experiencing her first painful birth. Now she was born again. It was like she had been paralyzed all her life, and now was being freed. It was a remarkable, and wonderful, event to witness. Brent in Pincher
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 11:17:31 AM
Re: good vs. better postings. I had an evangelist write in the following in my autograph book when I was a child: Good, Better, Best. Never let it rest, 'Till your good is better, and your better best! sharon in NNY
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 12:45:17 PM
I grew intrigued with the parapalegic suffering from the weight of his own guilt from sin. That led me to the Miller-Keane Medical Dictionary on WebMd for a description on Psychosomatic Illness. In the article, there is a line that reads, "The physical manifestations of an illness, unless caused by mechanical trauma, cannot be divorced from a person's emotional life. Each person responds in a unique way to stress; emotions affect one's sensitivity to trauma and to irritating elements in the environment, susceptibility to infection, and ability to recover from the effects of illness."
Could it be from this account that the parapalegic man suffered froma a psychosomatic illness that Jesus' forgiveness of the sin (since it was widely believed that sin caused the ailments) cured?
Mark in GA
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 2:44:04 PM
The roof fell in! I told you that if I went to hear Jesus preaching the roof would fall in!
GC in IL
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 6:40:32 PM
I've had more than my share of parishoners say that, if they attended church (after a long dry spell), the roof would cave in.
TB in MN
P.S. The best joke for this week so far is:
Immediately after the healing, the homeowner approached Jesus and said, "So... I hear you're dad's a carpenter..."
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 7:40:48 PM
I like the question: "Which 'is' easier, anyway? Forgiveness or healing?" I will head in the direction of Jesus' divinity. I can't let go of the image of the paralyzed man being lowered and then raised up (resurrected?) by Jesus. There are many healers, but only one God...the God of grace, new life, and resurrection.
Cam
Date: 2/20/2003
Time: 10:01:13 PM
"...The LORD does not look at the things man looks at. Man looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart." (1 Samuel 16:7)
This passage came to mind as I read Marks passage. I find it very intresting that these scribes were thinking thoughts of blasphemy against Jesus and Jesus picked up on that. Not a word came from their mouth... Jesus just knew what was in their hearts and posed the question to them which is easier to say, your sins are forgiven OR take up your mat and go home.
We all know the thought in that day was that anyone who was sick, crippled or suffering had been cursed by God. We see that mind set especially if we look at the story of Job when his friends try to convince him he has sinned against God and that is why he suffers. I am convinced this is what the scribes in Marks Gospel have in mind. Jesus' mission was to undo what seperated man from God. When Jesus says which is easier to say... I believe he is calling them on their own game so to speak. Healing of this paralized mans sin is only possible if God has a hand in it... picking up his mat and going home is only possible for those who have been restored to wholeness with God (free from sin).
So what does all this mean to the church today? As I see it, acting on faith, doing what ever it takes to bring wholeness back into our lives or into a life of another needs to be a priority. Tear the roof off if needed! What we know about God is not all there is to know. An open heart and mind can see God at work with eyes of faith if we just give the Lord a chance. Joshua once said, "But as for me and my household, we will serve the LORD." God is still amazing us today and we can see His work when we are thinking with our hearts open to a spirit of reconciliation (coming home to God). KB in Ks
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 12:31:16 AM
I just pop in and out of this site when I get to preach. Have I missed something? Is there an agreement not to talk about war with Iraq? I am struggling with preaching to a British Royal Air Force chapel this Sunday. Many of those folks are about to be, or will be, deployed to Iraq. I find myself paralized as I approach the sermon. I am deeply against the war but aware that many of these folks can't afford to go there. Here, in Germany, most of the people I am talking to (American military dependents) do feel paralized by the fear of impending war. I understand the command pick up your rug and walk. But I also have a sense that this can be the easy "just have faith" and everything will be okay kind of response. I wish this was my lectionary text this week. Unfortunately it is the prologue to John (Church of England.) So do you all have this war thing figured out, have you already preached it? Or are we all so paralized by the prospect of our own country declaring war not only in the name of freedom but in the name of Jesus Christ that we can't even begin to preach this to our people? SBB Germany
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 5:49:49 AM
Pick up your mat, restored to full relationship. How many are paralyzed by weak faith? Nancy-Wi
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 6:57:33 AM
Dear SBB
Over on the discussion portion of this site we've been wrangling about the war for some time. The majority of us who are posting over there are crying out for peace although some feel that war is the only answer to the situation in Iraq. You could go there and read some of our arguing although it's arguing from a point of relative safety, not from the point of one who is so close to the ones who will be putting their lives on the line.
I'll admit that I wouldn't know exactly what to say to the soldiers who may soon be heading over there. I'd pray that a peaceful resolution can still be found and that they wouldn't have to go. The mindset of one whose role it would be to fight is foreign to me. Is there any way to dialogue with others serving in military chaplaincy? Maybe others here on the lectionary side and some on the discussion side could help. Click on discussion and start a new thread stating your situation and see what others can say.
Shalom: Tom in Ontario
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 6:57:42 AM
Dear SBB
Over on the discussion portion of this site we've been wrangling about the war for some time. The majority of us who are posting over there are crying out for peace although some feel that war is the only answer to the situation in Iraq. You could go there and read some of our arguing although it's arguing from a point of relative safety, not from the point of one who is so close to the ones who will be putting their lives on the line.
I'll admit that I wouldn't know exactly what to say to the soldiers who may soon be heading over there. I'd pray that a peaceful resolution can still be found and that they wouldn't have to go. The mindset of one whose role it would be to fight is foreign to me. Is there any way to dialogue with others serving in military chaplaincy? Maybe others here on the lectionary side and some on the discussion side could help. Click on discussion and start a new thread stating your situation and see what others can say.
Shalom: Tom in Ontario
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 8:09:03 AM
SBB Germany. Thanks for your comments and question as to a general silence about the war. I would think that for some, who are closer to those who will be involved, it is an all-consuming dilemma. For others who live more removed from direct involvement, they (we) have spoken, diologued and prayed about it, and can't live in a constant state of focus on the war. With so many other issues that are being somewhat forgotten because of the emphasis on the war, a part of me does not want the war to highjack the world. There is, for me, a sense of getting on with life, as I still care about a peaceful and just resolve of this conflict. But I do think it is a good question to ask: 'are we paralyzed by fear or nationalism or lack of information about this important possibility?' Brent in Pincher
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 11:40:29 AM
To Tom in Ontario:
Your reply to SBB caught my eye. I am not a military chaplain, but I am a UM minister married to a member of the military. Taking your suggestion, I thought I would share my perception of "the mindset of those who fight." It is posted on the discussion site under "Military Community" for those who might want to read it.
Thanks to all for some very thought-provoking posts this week. As always, I am not sure I could pull something together by Sunday morning if I didn't lurk here during the week!
Peace, Pastor Beth
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 11:47:35 AM
Tom in Ontario:
I am not a military chaplain, but I am a pastor married to a member of the military. I took your suggestion and posted my observations about "the mindset of those who fight" on the discussion page. It is under the heading "Military Community" for any who wish to read it.
Thanks to all for some very thought-provoking posts this week. As always, I am not sure if I could come up with something by Sunday morning if I didn't lurk here all week!
Peace, Pastor Beth
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 12:04:04 PM
In an attempt to try to discover what this text is saying to me and to others about forgiveness and healing, I wrote a story about the paralyzed man. I named him "Mark", a single parent with two daughters, 6 and 4. While he is supposed to be caring for a neighbors daughter, 4-year old Amy, drowns in the lake behind Mark's house. He becomes paralyzed by guilt, remorse, and he does not believe that Jesus is able to forgive him. Disbelieving Jesus' power to forgive the unforgiveable, Mark is cut off from life, healing, and he cannot stand on his own. The rest of the story tells about how he is brought to Jesus by his small group(Amy's parents are part of that small group), and how Jesus' forgiveness of sin begins the process of moving him from death to new life. Jesus forgives his sin before he heals anything else. Jesus stood up after being in the grave for three days. Mark is empowered to stand up through the forgiveness of sin and the support of the community of faith.
Mark 2:1-12 is a powerful story of the miracle of reconciliation. We have never seen anything like this before.
Tom of MO
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 1:40:57 PM
Sorry for the double posting...it's pretty clear that this was my first time to put anything on this forum!
Peace, Pastor Beth
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 2:34:33 PM
Andy from NZ, Have you been reading my sermon??? A question I ask is, if our local church is not dynamic, why not? What is stopping us?? lp in CO
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 2:38:09 PM
Pastor Beth, and SBB: Pastor Beth: As a bivocational pastor, I, too, thank God for this DP site. SBB: at www.umc.org a couple of weeks ago there was a column by a UM pastor who is a military chaplain. I was so taken by his column on the Iraq situation that I republished it in the daily newspaper where I work. You might want to check it out. Blessings (and sorry for the personal post, team) Buzz
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 2:41:34 PM
TB in MN, Maybe the title should be "Ungraceful entrance; Graceful exit." Couldn't resist that! lp in CO
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 6:45:41 PM
SBB If you are tied to this week's scripture lessons, I preached last Sunday on the 2 Kings 5:1-14, and found the scripture to be leading me to ask the question, "Can our national pride and arrogance lead us to defeat and will God send a 'Naaman' type to remind us of our failure to trust God?" If we go to war, we must spend some time contemplating the fact that in time (either on earth or in heaven), we will know the rightness or the wrongness of our decision. Yet if we are wrong, God's grace is still efficacious. As you try to preach to those who may not return from war, you might convey the belief (that I have) that one can go with a humble spirit that allows one to say, "God if I am wrong, please forgive." I preached this to a congregation with men and women in reserve units who will get called up more than likely. It seemed to be well received. TN Mack
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 7:41:02 PM
1. I see by some of your postings that this text is the perfect reply to those who say, "If I came to church, the roof would fall in!" Our reply could be, "Friend, if it DOES fall in, you just might find you've dropped in on Jesus! Then you could relate this story.
2. PH in OH, bless you for quoting Bogey Dunn! I was lucky,as a first-year student at METHESCO, to get into his class on Mark, and as a senior, to hear him do a one-man recital of the Gospel of Mark (all from memory!). I don't think I've ever known anyone who knew Mark's gospel better, or could fill his sermons & observations on ANY part of Scripture with such life!
3. Eric in KS - I hope your exit Sunday is only a temporaryone from pastoral ministry, and I hope you keep posting to DPS! "Eric in KS" will be on my prayer list during this time. God be with you! Ken in WV
Date: 2/21/2003
Time: 7:59:15 PM
L'Anni
Latest stats on depression are one in four, something many can relate to.
KS in Me
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 8:01:05 AM
Aren't we all like the paralytic? Who can come to Christ on their own? Just like the paralytic, we too needed someone who loved us and willing to bring us to Christ.
All people are paralyzed on their own, but those selfless enough to bring God's children to the font are like the fantastic four who brought a man to Jesus.
Today I thank my parents for bringing me to Christ when I was once paralyzed. I thank them for allowing me to walk with the Lord.
A New Pastor on the Jersey Shore...
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 9:28:13 AM
Amy, my prayers are with you and your recently deployed spouse. I'm sure you feel "paralyzed" and I know our prayers and faith and the faith of your family and friends will continuously heal you through this rough time.
Eric, how exciting this time must be for you! I will pray that you find, in the wide-open spaces of opportunity facing you right now, the direction God wishes for your family! What an adventure! I hope as you take up your mat and go, you are doing so with the same kind of joy the other paralyzed man felt! Please don't stop contributing to DPS. Your insight is so helpful.
Pastor Janel in ND
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 11:34:32 AM
It is very late in the week for sermonizing, but God seems to do His best work with me on Saturdays. What an amazing Text for me this week. I am an Associate In Ministry for the Lutheran Church. I am getting to preach often as our church is without a full time pastor at this time. This week is my week. This Tuesday will mark the one year anniversary of my nearly 15 year old daughter being cancer free after a year of Horrifying treatment. She was told over and over again that she would not likely get cancer free. But hundreds of prayers and amazing Dr.s and the grace of God...she has had a year never promised. It will be easy to preach on this text!
Tammy Alvin, Texas
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 12:13:18 PM
Just finished a little tract entitled "The Christian and Anxiety" by Hans Urs von Balthasar, a Roman Catholic Theologian. He speaks of anxiety as a "narrowing." And uses the metaphor of the birth canal: "The ultimate meaning of the anguish experienced within contraction of the birth canal becomes clear: it is a subjective feeling of narrowing, during the objective process of expanding, in accordance with the paradox expressed in Psalm 4 (Vulgate): 'when I was in distress, you have enlarged a place for me." Or from the BCP: 'you set me free when I am hard pressed.' Or from the Tanakh 'You freed me from my distress.' Or from the Jerusalem Bible: 'when I am in trouble, you come to my relief.' Or from the NRSV: 'You gave me room wehn I was in distress.'
It seems to me that this metaphor shouts throughout the readings.
Isaiah: The Israelites had turned away from God, who could no longer act, they wearied him with their lethargicness, refusal to beleive that God could do a new thing. Their faith had become sterile and constricted, they had accepted their banishment. Yet God, forgives them bring them forth into a new relationship and place. The narrowing of their sins became the place where God's expansiveness was to be known. They were "birthed" into a new exodus!
The Gospel carries a similar theme: Sin has paralyzed this man, his spiritual life is sterile, he has become immobile, rigid in his iniquity, he has withdrawn from himself, unable to move.
Those who bring him to Jesus in faith first find that the door is blocked (also a narrow place), so four men, lift the stretcher up on the roof, thos inside removed the roof above Jesus, and those on the roof dug through it and lowered the man through the hole before Jesus ("through a narrow opening") In faith, this paralyzed man was brought before Jesus, and forgiven of his sins. Set free from all restriction and given new life, Jesus said "I say to you, stand up, take your mat and go to your home." And on hearing Jesus (obedience), the man stood up, and immediately took the mat and went out before them."
The Epistle simply states that God's Yes always awaits us in the future, we never have to fear, that he will condemn us, that all we need to do is reach out and embrace the yes in our lives. Then, our sinfulness is broken, our rigidity is denied, and we are lifted and lowered before our Savior.
tom in ga
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 1:27:48 PM
Thanks everyone for your good thoughts and prayers. I'm sure tomorrow is going to be just peachy....
My last sermon is posted on my website
http://consulting.thefunstons.com/
Just follow the navigation device to "sermons" and click on the "most recent" link.
Blessings to all, Eric in KS
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 3:16:07 PM
I sonet last night with the families of the fire victims in West Warwick, RI. I am struggling with preaching on a healing text in the face of so much pain
but then I realized that it was in the midst of a great deal of pian that the Isaiah text was written and Jesus brought His forgiveness and healing.
O that is my message tomorrow. Pastor Dana Warwick, RI
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 6:18:35 PM
I know this posting is late, and most of you will have long finished your work -- HA!
I've a story about the paralyzed being forgiven and finding healing. Not as dramatic as the gospel story, but just as authentic. For obvious reasons, I cannot use it in my sermon, but perhaps you can.
A woman I know was incapacitated with a mysterious malady. She hurt all over, especially in her joints. She was exhausted all the time. There were days when she couldn't hardly get out of bed, and then had just a few painful hours of productivity before being so tired she crept back to bed. For years, she sought help from a whole series of doctors, who ran every test they could think of, but they had no answers. Finally, a new physician in town who was building up his practice gave her his diagnosis -- fibromyalgia. He simply described the symptoms, not the disease. Many people suffer from it, but no one knows why. He was able to begin giving her new medications that lessened the symptoms, and just focused on those, because although there is no cure, there is some relief. At the same time as she was taking these new medications, she also found help in a line of personal magnets -- those that you wear, those that you lie on in a sleeping pad, etc. She soon started selling them herself, and began making some pretty good money.
She first started coming to my church as soon as she started having "good" mornings -- she could move well enough to get going to make it to the 10:30 service. After a few Sundays, she asked if she could become a member. I visited her at her home, and she told me her story, which opened my eyes.
She was going through a divorce. Her husband had abused her for years, both psychologically and physically. She had put up with it "because of their kids." As the kids got older, the beatings and the verbal assaults lessened, because they stood up for her. But the bad old times came back with a vengeance when the last child left. Then she started developing fibromyalgia. But at least when she was in bed most of the day, her abusive husband had some pity on her, and took care of the house as well as his regular chores. This pattern lasted for some years until he saw no hope for improvement, became frustrated with her, and began the assaults again. But she was a different woman this time. She was not helpless. She had a diagnosis for what ailed her. She had a job selling products that she believed brought help to others. She had suffered enough and filed for a divorce. And she wanted to ask me what I thought, if she was doing the right thing.
Of course, she was doing the right thing, and I told her so. I offered her encouragement and forgiveness. But I knew I could not tell her what else I knew. In the complicated relationship between body and soul, I saw how fear and guilt had somehow gotten mixed up with her health, and had added to her paralysis. One reason for her sickness, besides the mysterious disease, was the fact that when she was sick, her abusive husband didn't beat her, and did not attack her verbally has much. In the end -- who knows -- staying in bed and in pain was better than being attacked.
Part of the progression of her disease was aided by her decisions to continue staying married to this man, when she should have left many years before. The toll added up until she was very sick. I could see the burden of guilt she carried, but I also could see something else -- a person who was thinking about taking up her pallet and walking out of a failed marriage and into a better life. I held her hands and prayed for Christ's forgiveness and for God's love to fill her heart, and prayed that God would continue in the name of Jesus to bring her full healing. The following week she told me that my prayer confirmed what God was already telling her.
Since then, she's only improved month after month. A few years later she sold the house she was awarded in the divorce settlement and moved to Arizona, where the desert heat could help her joint pain. I see her in church every year when she drops by, and the improvement continues to make me marvel. Long gone is that paralyzed, passive, frail, permission-seeking person she had seen herself to be, and in its place is an active, strong, assertive person who is not afraid to be her own woman. And every time I see her, she says, "I give all the glory to God."
This, I know, will provoke many responses. I do not believe it was all in head, or in her soul. She still has a mysterious disease that causes her some pain. But it is no mystery that she started getting healing when she thought about changing her life, for good. She's healthy, she's happy, and she's forgiven. AMEN!
How many of us have prolonged or aggravated our diseases through our sinful, wrong choices? How many of us have chosen to be passive because it at least means that someone is taking care of us? How many of us need Jesus to proclaim the word of forgiveness and then challenge us to take up our pallet and walk?
AO in PO
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 6:36:02 PM
Today in Seminary class, Systematic theology, we mentioned Forgiveness with the Book that Dr Parks of United Seminary wrote. The Wounded heart of God. Liberation Theologist talk about oppressed people... Like native Americans wanting Apology and stuff, we as white humans ask for forgiveness, but in society we need to progress on, but they wan the land issue.... This Question came up. Does forgiveness and Restitution go hamd in hand... I "forgive" you but expect recapitaulation? Some, of us disagreed with the professor, Forgivenes is I forgive you without expectation... no restitution expected. Now, the Holy Spirit can work on that other party to do that. Kinda Like Saying I am sorry when you think you did nothing wrong... and perhaps you didnt... Are we responsiblr for crimesof ancestors... if so what does that mean about JESUS paying it all...Can we ever pay him back? Just food for thought Pastor Mary of Ohio
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 8:33:02 PM
This reminds me of a young man who drank alot and seemed to have alot of trouble in his marriage,and their was allways trouble brewing in his life. several times I had made a trip to the hospital to pray for him, even thought he wasn't very old he had a few heart attacks. ever timed I prayed for him The Lord would heal him. He was a welder by trade and one time he had his eye cut by a splinter of metal. His wife called and we went and prayed for him and God healed him again right on the spot. One day his wife called again and asked if we (me and my wife) would come to their house, and we did. When we got their they gave us the news that the doctor said that the young man had lung cancer. I said to him how many times will the Lord heal you before you give you life to him. we had prayer for him and he gave his life to the Lord and the Lord healed him.No cancer. But he neverentered the church doors and never turned his life around. Now he has a new wife and his life is still a mess. Easy come easy go. I don't know, but which is easy to say your sins are forgiven or get up and walk.
Date: 2/22/2003
Time: 8:35:40 PM
sorry i forgot to post my name pastor Roger WV
Date: 7/17/2003
Time: 4:08:23 PM
personally forgiveness of sins is From God
and Jesus was God man and gave people and he was fulfilling the prophet Isaiah 61 to proclaim liberty freedom captive or held prisoner by some thing this man was paralytic and Jesus did heal him from this situation of being lame and trapped by not being able to walk