Year 2002 contributions:
Date: 20 March 2002
Time: 06:17:55
In our local text study, the issue of the "nominal" Christian was brought up, those who are unwilling to live a life of visible Christian service. This is in contrast to the life of Christ, who did not count equality with God as something to be exploited, grasped, ...
The "nominal" Christian does grasp the promise of God, exploiting it by reaping the benefit without responding in service. Any thoughts?
Michelle
Date: 20 March 2002
Time: 18:31:49
I think that we walk on thin ice when we begin to differentiate between "kinds" of Christians. Are we not all saved by grace alone? Are we not all called to be rooted in that grace, to find our being in that grace? Can we be in a state of receiving only a little grace? The question of works is about how we relate to each other, how we live in the grace that is freely ours. It does not determine a hierarchy of Christians with the "really active ones" at the top and the slovenly ones on the bottom rung. All this is not to say that what we "do" as Christians is unimportant; rather, it is important that we do not mix up our being with our doing. Being is about grace; doing is about living out of grace... Bill in S'toon
Date: 20 March 2002
Time: 22:12:28
"Let this mind be in you that was in Christ Jesus." This ancient hymn of christology is in the above verse a radical call for each disciple. Can we empty ourselves, humble ourselves, even die to self in the pattern of Jesus? Christ is the foundation of the church and to bear his image we must continue in the "way of service." Is our church a community of "servant" disciples that represents Christ to the world? A world of need cries out for help and only servants answer. This is how Christ is glorified, when we die in order to love. I will try to place this text in the context of world affairs as we face a world of uncertainty and fear- What is our comfort: Jesus suffered for a world that didn't know how to love, by example he gave the world hope. HOw can we bring life to a world that doesn't love: we die each day and learn the heart of service-helping a neighbor who is alone, taking time to tutor school kids, volunteering to reach the poor in the community with transportation, etc. For each of us it will be a different list, but we will be servants of the ONe who emptied himself for us and the world. bobby in Tx.
Date: 21 March 2002
Time: 07:38:10
Since we will be reading the whole Passion narrative this Sunday, I will have a short sermon. But I was thinking about this hymn which Paul records for us. As with everything about this God we worship, it had to be quite a stretch for anyone to believe in a suffering, humble God.
I was thinking in particular about the gods of ancient Greece-- I don't have much background about those old stories-- but I remember something about how it was the greatest ideal for a human to strive to be like the gods. And even about some catastrophies that happened when in that striving, humans ended up with all sorts of problems.
How different from this idea, and foreign to that culture, to have a God who is willing to humble himself to become human-- and not just human, but a slave-- and not just a slave, but one who is willing to die a horrible death.
OK-- now that I've shown my total ignorance about ancient Greece, are there those out there who can help me get a better grasp of this whole idea. What do you think? Will it preach? joinva
Date: 21 March 2002
Time: 12:59:14
I am stuck on the NLT's version of verse 5. It starts, "Your attitude should be the same as Christ Jesus had..." Some definitions of 'attitude' are as follows: 1) to dispose or interest oneself in; 2) a mental position or feeling in regard to an object; 3) the position of something in relation to something else; or 4) position of an aircraft relative to a reference datum (ie. horizon)
I find myself drawn to the fourth definition. If Jesus' attitude was one of humility, or flying under the clouds, under the glory, under the upturned noses of the proud, even below the earth in death, and we are to have that same attitude (having our aircraft in the same position relative to the fixed point), the question is, what is your attitude? Paul concludes this by writing (v. 9) "Because of this, god raised him up to the heights of heaven..." In order to truly soar, we must be willing to crash! Just ramblings on a Thursday. Tell me what you think. UMPREACH
Date: 21 March 2002
Time: 12:59:34
I am stuck on the NLT's version of verse 5. It starts, "Your attitude should be the same as Christ Jesus had..." Some definitions of 'attitude' are as follows: 1) to dispose or interest oneself in; 2) a mental position or feeling in regard to an object; 3) the position of something in relation to something else; or 4) position of an aircraft relative to a reference datum (ie. horizon)
I find myself drawn to the fourth definition. If Jesus' attitude was one of humility, or flying under the clouds, under the glory, under the upturned noses of the proud, even below the earth in death, and we are to have that same attitude (having our aircraft in the same position relative to the fixed point), the question is, what is your attitude? Paul concludes this by writing (v. 9) "Because of this, god raised him up to the heights of heaven..." In order to truly soar, we must be willing to crash! Just ramblings on a Thursday. Tell me what you think. UMPREACH
Date: 22 March 2002
Time: 12:05:54
Joinva, You're on the right track with the Greek gods. They were seen by the Greeks as wholly detached, wholly unlike humans. It was inconceivable to them that the gods would ever exhibit any human qualities. These points are mentioned in an article, Empathy and the New Testament, by L. Ann Jervis. To read this article, go to The Text This Week at www.textweek.com and follow the links for this Sunday to this scripture text. Ken in WV
Year 2000 contributions:
Date: 05 Apr 2000
Time: 16:18:23
Does the "should" in these verses mean that even after Jesus is apparent to all to be the Messiah, that even then some will bow down to honor and worship Him? And if they do bow down, does that mean that they are indeed "saved" at that point?
Marty@cfmc
Date: 07 Apr 2000
Time: 01:18:46
Marty - I don't believe so. I believe that the passage speaks, regrettably, of those realizing, too late, that Jesus indeed is Lord.
However, I am a Baptist, and many here may have other thought. However, one point is vital to note. People often speak of making Jesus Lord of their lives. They cannot do this. Jesus is indeed Lord of their lives. He is Lord of every Christian, every atheist, every Hindu, every ... whatever. He is Lord. The question is, will you kneel to Him now ... or when it's too late?
Hope this sheds some light and that, through your message, many will kneel ... now.
JG in WI
Date: 10 Apr 2000
Time: 18:59:01
JG in WI, Thanks for your input. I do think too that many will realize too late that Jesus is Lord and realize that they have failed to bow before in life and will find that it is then too late. I do wonder though if Jesus can really be Lord of someone's life if they refuse to acknowledge His Lordship? Maybe this is just a matter of semantics?! Marty@cfmc
Date: 10 Apr 2000
Time: 21:38:34
JG in WI to Marty@cfmc
Well, perhaps it is semantical. But, as an American, Bill Clinton is my president. I may choose to obey him as such or not, but that doesn't change the fact.
Jesus Christ is Lord of the universe and Lord of every person.
If it's semantics, then it is. However, with this in mind, I tend to preach to Christians that they have already decided (supposedly) to yield to His Lordship. But I add that this yieldedness is a moment-by-moment expression of what should have been a once-and-for-all decision.
God bless, friend.
Date: 12 Apr 2000
Time: 03:56:19
I'm not preaching this week, but love to read the postings anyway, to hear the questions and inspirations that everyone shares. This passage, and much of Philippians, does something to my heart. It feels ...rapturous with joy, triumphant, ecstatic ... Perhaps I'm not tracking the issue about "semantics," but I hope you don't lose the joy and the awe and the wonder of this passage as you preach it.
I offer these comments in a spirit of love, and mean no discourtesy with them. Grace and peace, Janice, Ks.
Date: 12 Apr 2000
Time: 12:26:49
Marty, this passage has giving me years of food for thought. Given that, I still have not come to grips with it. About 12 years ago I asked a beloved professor, "if they do bow down, does that mean that they are indeed "saved" at that point?" It was in slightly different words but you asked the gist of my question. The dilemma that I face in this reading is that I am unable to resolve the continued existence of evil in the coming kingdom. In my mind either one of two thing must take place; 1) All must be converted in the end even Lucifer, 2) Those that are obdurate in wickedness must cease to exist. This is contrary to the doctrine that there is a Hell with ever lasting punishment - something that I do accept as true.
The good doctor and I spoke of Origen and he suggested that I read C.S. Lewis' "The Great Divorce." In that book Lewis portrays evil and its proponents becoming ever smaller and ending in total darkness ever approaching nothingness but like a hyperbolic curve never quite reaching zero.
This is not anything that I would preach on because it all it would do is muddy people's thought and would be unhelpful. It is my own problem that evidently you share. I don't see resolution of this question anytime soon and probably the answer will only be forthcoming when time ceases.
J.G., you may be right, but it still doesn't wash with me. I have a staunch belief in that God will never violate free will forcing anyone to "bow". This issue was discussed on the WTS site last year when the subject was "The Theodicy." If interested you might read through the posts there at this link.
http://www.javacasa.com/wts/intro_theodicy.htm
Deke in Texas - Pace et Bene
Date: 13 Apr 2000
Time: 00:23:53
To Deke in TExas,
Have you ever considered the different approach between the LAmb of God and the Lion of Judah? In the tension I see the gentle savior returning as the conquering Lion of the Tribe.
Just something to think about as we stretch towards Sunday.
Pastor Bill in NY
Date: 13 Apr 2000
Time: 18:20:40
I love to come to this site and read the postings. You are all an inspiration to me and I appreciate your words. I don't often contribute but feel led to say something. In the case of believing that God would not "violate free-will forcing anyone to bow," when the day comes that we are face to face with the Savior of the world, the King of kings and Lord of lords, we won't be able to keep from bowing!
Since this passage falls on Palm Sunday, I'm going to approach it this week from the standpoint of exaltation. That Jesus is (just like the hymn says) "hope of earth and joy of heaven!"
Date: 13 Apr 2000
Time: 18:21:41
I'm sorry! I forgot to sign my post. Pastor Mark in IL
Date: 13 Apr 2000
Time: 21:35:59
JG in WI to Deke in Texas
Interesting article. Thanks for sharing it.
I could clarify by saying that the confession that "Jesus Christ is Lord" will not necessarily "forced" against the free will of even Satan, but that those who rebel will be faced with the incontrovertable fact that He is Lord and will bow down, not in violation of will, but having no other choice.
If I were falling from an airplane, it may be against my will to continue falling, but I have no other options. Jesus' lordship, and the rebels' confession of it, will be like that; no choice and too late (regrettably) to change the inevitable.
There is no joy in speaking of such things. Would to God that all would bow in this life to Christ's lordship. Such is my prayer.
Peace to you all, and may many bow before Him in your various churches this Palm Sunday and every Sunday thereafter.
Date: 14 Apr 2000
Time: 14:01:48
I am taking a different take from the postings I've read so far. Paul's exhortation is that the same "mind" that was in Christ be formed in the believer. From what follows one can see that the "mind" of Christ is one of humble servanthood. With Holy Week beginning, I want my congregation to consider if humility and service are active traits of their discipleship to Christ.
Humility and service are not popular themes in our culture. Our competitive consumer mentality rejects such values as being inferior.
Does anyone have any thoughts along these lines?
D. Morris Alabama
dmorris@wrldnet.net
Date: 14 Apr 2000
Time: 14:02:41
I am taking a different take from the postings I've read so far. Paul's exhortation is that the same "mind" that was in Christ be formed in the believer. From what follows one can see that the "mind" of Christ is one of humble servanthood. With Holy Week beginning, I want my congregation to consider if humility and service are active traits of their discipleship to Christ.
Humility and service are not popular themes in our culture. Our competitive consumer mentality rejects such values as being inferior.
Does anyone have any thoughts along these lines?
D. Morris Alabama
dmorris@wrldnet.net
Date: 14 Apr 2000
Time: 21:09:40
Interesting thoughts about the bowing down. As an ancient Christian hymn, I always took this scripture to refer to the "span of Jesus" from his incarnation (emptied himself, taking the form...) and his final exultation (therefore God has exalted). To me this meant that the "every knee bending" was a hymn of celebration about an eschatalogical hope/assurance that in the end God in Christ would prevail. But I too am going in a different direction. This Lent we are working on a theme of "Broken and Blessed." I'm impressed how we in our humanity are a mixture of blessedness/giftedness and brokenness. Not unlike Christ's earthly being of divinity and broken humanity. This hymn reminds me that the road to exultation is through emptying, humility, and service. In our emptying, when we ask, we too are filled with God's power. Don in CO
Date: 14 Apr 2000
Time: 21:33:57
To D.Morris in Alabama,
Here's another thought about Jesus taking the form of a servant from F.F. Bruce's commentary on Phil. when speaking about Jesus not counting equality with God as something to be "grasped." (Bruce)"The interpreters' crux lies in the Greek noun harpagmos...which is derived from a verb that means "snatch" or "seize." There is no question of Christ's trying to snatch or seize equality with God: that was already his because he always had the natur of God. ...The point is rather that he did not treat his equality with God as an excuse for self-assertion or self-aggrandizement; on the contrary, he treaed it as an occasion for renouncing every advantage or privilege that might have accrued to him thereby, as an opportunity for self-impoverishment and unreserved self-sacrifice."
My thought is that in N.A., we have the power to "seize" our god-ness. Through the wealth of education, money, status, and supportive networks, we may choose to not be servants. That's why we need the mind of Christ the calls us in another direction.
Don in CO
Date: 16 Apr 2000
Time: 04:16:35
Don in Co.
Thanks for the insight from Bruce. Its not too late to work that into tomorrow's sermon.
Date: 16 Apr 2000
Time: 04:23:16
Don in Co.
Thanks for the insight from Bruce. Its not too late to work that into tomorrow's sermon.
Date: 16 Apr 2000
Time: 04:23:30
Don in Co.
Thanks for the insight from Bruce. Its not too late to work that into tomorrow's sermon.
1998/99 Contributions:
I'm working on the idea of 'The Rhythm of Obedience' and will use Luther's Palm Sunday sermon on Phil2: 5-11, De duplici iustitia for March 19, 1518 (?). David Whitelaw e-mail dwhitela@ptloma.edu
To me this passage is the heart of our faith - God voluntarily submitting himself to the vagaries of humanity by allowing himself to not only be found in human form but in the form of a slave. When Paul writes to have the same mind that is "in Christ" (there's that phrase again!), he's implying that we should surrender our personal sovereignty (yeah, right!) to be in unity with Christ - and what usually happens is that we try to bend Christ to read, and act as we wish so that we can have our own personal desires validated - especially in Ad Board meetings, Pastor-Parish committees, etc. We need to be more aware of the idea of unity, and not uniformity, as well. Are we "one with Christ, one with each other, and one in ministry to all the world?" If we take this passage seriously, the Eucharist becomes more valid each time of celebration - if our congregations are prepared to proclaim Christ's death for themselves. We must appropriate the fact that Christ was obedient even "to death on [the] cross" for ME, and every other "me" in the congregation. To often Christ dies for the "other sinners" Rev. Rick - and ah' tis Spring, with clear skies, wonderful balmy breezes, and pollen counts in astronomical numbers.
To me this is a passage about surrender and community. We live in a society that has lifted individual autonomy above community and this passage calls the pendulum to swing a bit in the other direction. Community is costly. God's community with the human race meant self-emptying, humbling, dying... This is the mind that was in Jesus, is it the mind that is in us?
These are some thoughts I've had the last few days about this text in Phil. 2. It seems to me that so much of the "American Dream" - that part about "getting ahead," that part about getting to the top," that part about "getting more and more stuff", that part about being the "most powerful nation in the world" stands in stark contrast to the "mind of Christ." it seems that so many of our own hopes and dreams for ourselves and for our children - about having a nice house, about being able to live comfortably, about having a long, successful, happy life and about a leisurely retirement - stand in stark contrast to Jesus' own life and ministry. So, too, so many of our own expectations about God, - about how we think God "should act," or what we think God "should do" in the world - stand in stark contrast with how God did act and what God did do in Christ.
How different might each of US be - if those of us who call ourselves Jesus' disciples - responded to the hurts and pains infllicted upon us more like Jesus did and less in ways that otherwise seem to come so naturally? How different might the church be - if we all in the church - acted more like Jesus did and less like a business or a club? How different might our world be - we, in the church, acted more like Jesus did and less like "Rambo?"
On the other hand, it's possible that the world we live in wouldn't change much at all. The world, after all, hasn't "improved" much since Jesus day with regard to acts of violence inflicted on the innocent and hatred for those we don't like. But I think we, and the church, would be acting toward each other and thinking far differently about each other, and we would be relating to the world differently - if we had "the mind of Christ."
It's also possible that we might even get "crucified" by the world for acting just like Jesus did. We might get "crucified" - figuratively - instead of literally, of course. But as we contemplate even that possibility, let's not forget that God is never left without options. Let's not forget that the events of Palm Sunday, Maundy Thursday and Good Friday were followed by Easter - but that is a topic for another day. Grace and Peace, Jerry in MN
Jerry, it's not the "Rambo" image that bothers me. It's the guy (or girl) in the stands with that big foam rubber glove on with the index finger up in the air. "We're Number ONE!!" Goes right along with "Look our for Number One!" I'm not sure I'm ready to throw away the capitalist economic system yet, but I wish someone would find a way to harness the commercials for it, everything, and nothing. I've walked in corporate board rooms, and seen offices bigger than some houses with more amenities than some foriegn leaders. I've also driven through neighborhoods in my home town in which people lived in squalor - no running water, no doors on the front of the multiple apartments each with multiple families - and taught kids from those kinds of communities. In Phil. - Christ speaks directly to the desparity between those who can hide from the needs of others and those who can't hide from need. Where are those who are ready to empty themselves of power to gain real power? I'm going to include the 1-4th verses in the reading - to remind us that there is consolation in Christ. God Bless, all. Rev. Rick.
Seems there is a warning here, for those who would be God....
Nick In Louisiana
The Church to which Paul is writing in this epistle obviously had some contentions in it. The fourth chapter points to that. The cure for those contentions is to zero in on who and what is really important. The Lord Jesus did not consider His Deity something that was to hold him back from doing the will of the Father but rather was willing to clothe himself in human form and take on the form of a servant. Donald Grey Barnhouse once said" Satan said ' I will go up up up until I am seated at the right hand of God.' (Isaiah 14) and God said "You will go down down to the lowest Hell." The Son said "I will go down to the lowest Hell to redeem your chosen ones" and the Father said " And I will lift you up and give you a name above every name."
Gloriously true is this teaching. His humiliation was necessary for our salvation and that same humiliation becomes a template for those who are saved by faith in His shed blood. Oh to have a servant's heart in the year 1999 so that position and rank mean nothing and people around us are not evaluated by their rank and wealth but that all things would be done to the glory of Christ.
Glen in Pa.
"He was born in a stable, so I could live in palaces. He had nothing so I could have everything. He was forsaken by all He loved, so that I would never be alone. He was made sin so I could know righteousness."
This passage to me illustrates the "divine romance" of the ages. "He was born in a stable so I could live in His palaces. Made lower than angels so I could inherit the heavens. He had nothing so I could have everything. He was forsaken by all He loved so that I would never have to be alone. He was made sin so I could know righteousness." We make a serious mistake when we think of Jesus doing this for himself. He did it for us. He earned again what He already posessed by virtue of who He was, so that when He was done He had a "surplus" righteousness and this He gave to us to be our very own posession. Wonderful love. I bow my knee and call Him Lord! To God all the glory! Mike in MA.
Mike and unknown poster,
What is the source of that beautiful quotation -- "He was born in a stable so I could live in His palaces. . ." ?
--Rod in Pixley
Someone liked my last contribution of a skeleton outline, so here's another. When I preached this last time, we had a new baby, so I drew an analogy between getting ready for a new baby and getting ready for the celebration of the Resurrection. Either one is coming, ready or not, but we enjoy both better if we are ready. David in King, NC
To be ready for Easter, we need to ....
1. Think like Jesus, 2:5-7.
2. Act like Jesus, 2:7-8.
3. Focus on Jesus, 2:9-11.
How do we focus on Jesus? Bow the knee--act like Jesus really is in charge, Confess His Lordship--say that Jesus really is in charge, Glorify His Father--because Jesus really is in charge.
Was the quotation "he was born in a stable" etc. from a song? a hymn perchance? I am interested in Paul's use of a hymn to make his point about the humility of Christ. I intend to preach about our attempts at unity, and about humility as being the key to being of one mind--the mind of Christ. Paul used a hymn to speak powerfully and with great imagery to the shared experience of the people he was addressing. We too have a shared storehouse of hymns which speak to us eloquently. We sing them together. During those moments of song, we are united. Can we learn to live our lives as we sing our hymns of praise, focusing not ONLY upon our own needs and our own self-worth, but ALSO upon the gifts and needs of others? Is this humility? Does it unite us? These are early thoughts, but its getting late. Any helpful comments? Pam in San Bernardino
This is a test. I have been attempting to contribute recently, but my contributions aren't showing up. Pam in San Bernardino
What does this speak to our misuse of authority as individuals and as a nation? What do we exploit? Mark in Va.
As I ready Phil. 2:5-11 for a Palm Sunday sermon, I am constraining myself from talking about me, my needs, and my people. It's so tempting to skim the surface of a sermon text and get to what we feel the people want: they want application ... how does Phil. 2:5-11 apply to me?
Before the "personal application" must come "Christ appropriation." My people MUST hear about the person and the work and the words of Christ so the eyes of their faith have blinders to shut out everything except Christ. If people realize the extent of Christ's love as he rode triumphantly toward his death, if they grow in a single ounce of faith, then we've successfully appropriated Christ! I'd rather spend 20 minutes appropriating Christ to someone's faith, than 20 minutes of sermon applications that fail to motivate people with our Lord and Savior. May our sermons never fail to proclaim Jesus Christ and him crucified!
Dubby in Topeka
Dear Rod in Pixley The quote is from a song I heard 12 years ago now that made a profound impression on me. I cannot remember the name of the singer/writer anymore and have little hope of locating it. Blessings. Mike in MA